Opinion: Why the Scout nails it for EV Trucks / SUVs: Towing & Long Distance Trips

[itsrixter]

In general, an EREV takes care of the issue of range anxiety but a 500-mile range battery (like Lucid) also addresses range anxiety for most car owners.

However, range concerns for a truck, especially towing, multiply the problem; when you are camping, it is exponentiated. So the Harvester option on Scouts really hits the mark as I explain in detail. My use case is this: Towing jetskis to the Colorado River with gear loaded up. San Diego to the Arizona border (approx 200 miles). Camping along the river with options to rent a campsite with hookups if I want or need it.

The typical EV range is cut in half when towing. That is due to increased weight and drag, adding a hill (or mountain range in my case) and/or headwinds and it takes a bigger cut into the range. So something like a Cybertruck drops from 320 mi range to 160 mi. So now you have to add a charge stop. No big deal, with EVs you get used to it and include it into the plan. However, the charging spots are designed for single-vehicle parking in most cases. Now what, you disconnect a trailer to charge then re-connect? Screw that, now it's pointless to tow with an EV truck (in my 200-mile example).

With a Scout, I could make the trip and not have to go to a campsite with hookups...and I can have wifi via satellite! The motor is a generator so I can power my campsite.

The Cybertruck (which I had put a deposit on day one in 2019) was supposed to have a 600 mi range and was planned on utilizing the charging capabilities (350 kWh) and Tesla Semi charging stations (pull-through design). Neither of those features came through. So I canceled my rsvp. The Chevy Silverado was very tempting as the range at 440 mi and the design and features look impressive. The Silverado battery like my Teslas, will lose range with age so even with a 440-mile rating, it will be super close for my example trip.

So the EREV in my opinion is an ideal approach to trucks and SUVs for people who tow distances or travel long distances in non-urban areas. Then use it for daily work commutes with zero gas! I don't think cars in metropolitan areas need EREV. For me, if I can drive to LA and back to San Diego without charging (225 miles round trip) a healthy 350-mile range EV car is fine.

Great job Scout, on your plan and approach. Now please execute and don't pull a Cybertruck and come up short from announced specs and pricing

 

[Mousehunter]

One thing I have not really tried to research is the interaction of wind resistance and weight affect when towing. A jetski trailer will be relatively light and fairly low wind drag. Sadly, at least 1 of the 2 light tows I might use the EV for has a nice sail on it to block wind.

 

[quikster]

In general, an EREV takes care of the issue of range anxiety but a 500-mile range battery (like Lucid) also addresses range anxiety for most car owners.

However, range concerns for a truck, especially towing, multiply the problem; when you are camping, it is exponentiated. So the Harvester option on Scouts really hits the mark as I explain in detail. My use case is this: Towing jetskis to the Colorado River with gear loaded up. San Diego to the Arizona border (approx 200 miles). Camping along the river with options to rent a campsite with hookups if I want or need it.

The typical EV range is cut in half when towing. That is due to increased weight and drag, adding a hill (or mountain range in my case) and/or headwinds and it takes a bigger cut into the range. So something like a Cybertruck drops from 320 mi range to 160 mi. So now you have to add a charge stop. No big deal, with EVs you get used to it and include it into the plan. However, the charging spots are designed for single-vehicle parking in most cases. Now what, you disconnect a trailer to charge then re-connect? Screw that, now it's pointless to tow with an EV truck (in my 200-mile example).

With a Scout, I could make the trip and not have to go to a campsite with hookups...and I can have wifi via satellite! The motor is a generator so I can power my campsite.

The Cybertruck (which I had put a deposit on day one in 2019) was supposed to have a 600 mi range and was planned on utilizing the charging capabilities (350 kWh) and Tesla Semi charging stations (pull-through design). Neither of those features came through. So I canceled my rsvp. The Chevy Silverado was very tempting as the range at 440 mi and the design and features look impressive. The Silverado battery like my Teslas, will lose range with age so even with a 440-mile rating, it will be super close for my example trip.

So the EREV in my opinion is an ideal approach to trucks and SUVs for people who tow distances or travel long distances in non-urban areas. Then use it for daily work commutes with zero gas! I don't think cars in metropolitan areas need EREV. For me, if I can drive to LA and back to San Diego without charging (225 miles round trip) a healthy 350-mile range EV car is fine.

Great job Scout, on your plan and approach. Now please execute and don't pull a Cybertruck and come up short from announced specs and pricing

Good use case, but just making sure you know the EREV isn't 350 miles EV only its 150 miles EV + 350 miles Harvester.

Personally 150 miles will get me just about anywhere locally on a regular basis especially since we are at sea level with no real hills or mountains nearby. Then when I want to go up to the mountains ~310 miles away up hill I can go and bring my kayaks on their trailer without having to stop and unhook them somewhere to charge.

 

[Deuce]

EREV is perfect for me. 150 miles will get me to almost everything I do, but it's going to be a long time before I trust charging infrastructure. Plus as Doug Demuro pointed out, to drive an EV across the country, charging would add an extra day to the trip. That's an extra hotel stay too. I know it's a very specific use case, but it really shows you what charging times do to EV's. And you're damned if you do and damned if you don't with quick charging your wearing out your battery sooner. We're just not there yet with batteries (IMHO), but the Scout is the perfect stopgap for the next 5-10 years.

 

[quikster]

Am I the only one who flinches a bit every time I see the term "use case" misused as it is in this (and many other) threads?
I might expect this from young software designers, but I suspect you guys are older than that?
The even more irksome misused term (becoming more popular, too) is, "bespoke."

Sheeeeeeeesh!

guess what my degree is in computer science with a master's in security

 

[Latrant]

Am I the only one who flinches a bit every time I see the term "use case" misused as it is in this (and many other) threads?
I might expect this from young software designers, but I suspect you guys are older than that?
The even more irksome misused term (becoming more popular, too) is, "bespoke."

Sheeeeeeeesh!

I have lots of Bespoke Use-cases. Great Luggage! 🥹

 

[cherrios111]

EREV is perfect for me. 150 miles will get me to almost everything I do, but it's going to be a long time before I trust charging infrastructure. Plus as Doug Demuro pointed out, to drive an EV across the country, charging would add an extra day to the trip. That's an extra hotel stay too. I know it's a very specific use case, but it really shows you what charging times do to EV's. And you're damned if you do and damned if you don't with quick charging your wearing out your battery sooner. We're just not there yet with batteries (IMHO), but the Scout is the perfect stopgap for the next 5-10 years.

I have driven EV across the country, SoCal to DC twice so the range anxiety is a thing of the past. Planning though is a heavy task for now, ensuring there are proper fast changing stations in my routes. I do not plan to go for the Haverster and opt for the maximum electric range which should be about 100 more miles per change than my current option. So for me, one less overnight stop which will be great for me. What concerns me is towing across the country. I do not use an EV to do this now but plan to use the Terra to tow a box trailer across the country. So like the OP stated, my biggest concerns are drag and weight effects on battery efficiency. I am still game though but I think I would take some single day towing test runs before an epic adventure.

 

[quikster]

I have driven EV across the country, SoCal to DC twice so the range anxiety is a thing of the past. Planning though is a heavy task for now, ensuring there are proper fast changing stations in my routes. I do not plan to go for the Haverster and opt for the maximum electric range which should be about 100 more miles per change than my current option. So for me, one less overnight stop which will be great for me. What concerns me is towing across the country. I do not use an EV to do this now but plan to use the Terra to tow a box trailer across the country. So like the OP stated, my biggest concerns are drag and weight effects on battery efficiency. I am still game though but I think I would take some single day towing test runs before an epic adventure.

There are a couple RV trailers coming out with their own batteries and power to basically make them neutral to tow. If that goes well I could see other trailers getting similar technology

 

[itsrixter]

I have driven EV across the country, SoCal to DC twice so the range anxiety is a thing of the past. Planning though is a heavy task for now, ensuring there are proper fast changing stations in my routes. I do not plan to go for the Haverster and opt for the maximum electric range which should be about 100 more miles per change than my current option. So for me, one less overnight stop which will be great for me. What concerns me is towing across the country. I do not use an EV to do this now but plan to use the Terra to tow a box trailer across the country. So like the OP stated, my biggest concerns are drag and weight effects on battery efficiency. I am still game though but I think I would take some single day towing test runs before an epic adventure.

Wow, towing cross country in a pure EV. It will be interesting to see the total cost of charging is one way. My son drove from Laguna Hills, CA (SoCal) to San Francisco and his Tesla supercharging bill was $43

 

[itsrixter]

There are a couple RV trailers coming out with their own batteries and power to basically make them neutral to tow. If that goes well I could see other trailers getting similar technology

I've seen a few modern trailers, one is Pebble that was designed by former Tesla engineer. It was cool and you could move it around from an app on your phone to connect/ diconnect but after reading your comment, I went back and it does have tow assist which powers the wheels while towing. see at the 10:28 mark:

 

[quikster]

I've seen a few modern trailers, one is Pebble that was designed by former Tesla engineer. It was cool and you could move it around from an app on your phone to connect/ diconnect but after reading your comment, I went back and it does have tow assist which powers the wheels while towing. see at the 10:28 mark:

That’s one of them there was another I saw too but I’ll have to look it up later. The cheapest version of the trailer doesn’t include the power for helping tow but it is an option

 

[itsrixter]

The average distance to work rose to 27 miles at the end of 2023 from 10 miles in 2019, according to Gusto's study of 52,000 employees at more than 6,800 businesses (from a Wall Street Journal article)

According to the AAA Foundation for Traffic Safety, the average car trip length for an American is around 12.2 miles. This means most Americans typically drive less than 12 miles for a single car trip.

Key points about average car trip distances:

• Nearly 60% of all vehicle trips in the US are less than 6 miles long.
• Around 75% of car trips are 10 miles or less.

I saw an article indicating off-roading lowers your range by only 15-20% but I can’t seem to find it to demonstrate how that calculation was made. So, a day trip to go off-roading doesn’t seem to be a factor for getting an EREV.

Given the data above you could conclude that most EVs meet the demand for the majority of what a vehicle is used for in the U.S. (i.e. a 250-mile range EV). It’s the 10-15% of other types of trips that trigger the larger battery capacity or EREV “need”. If you camp for a few days, go overlanding in remote areas, or tow long distances and still want an EV, the EREV seems to be the solution. Having a used second vehicle - a gas truck/ SUV could be a viable solution as well.

I think the biggest missing piece is the cost of the EREV Scout vs the EV version to make a final determination.

 

[cherrios111]

Wow, towing cross country in a pure EV. It will be interesting to see the total cost of charging is one way. My son drove from Laguna Hills, CA (SoCal) to San Francisco and his Tesla supercharging bill was $43

My last trip cost $330 across, and return was $300, so just over $600 round trip.

 

[Deuce]

I have driven EV across the country, SoCal to DC twice so the range anxiety is a thing of the past. Planning though is a heavy task for now, ensuring there are proper fast changing stations in my routes. I do not plan to go for the Haverster and opt for the maximum electric range which should be about 100 more miles per change than my current option. So for me, one less overnight stop which will be great for me. What concerns me is towing across the country. I do not use an EV to do this now but plan to use the Terra to tow a box trailer across the country. So like the OP stated, my biggest concerns are drag and weight effects on battery efficiency. I am still game though but I think I would take some single day towing test runs before an epic adventure.

The point about taking another day was the actual charging time not range anxiety. I'm sure there's plenty of chargers not too far out of the way of anywhere, but I don't want to just hang out and wait that long on the road. I've heard there are charging stations that are starting to be built around cafe's and such which is cool, but then while you wait inside you're going to be expected to buy things. It'll get figured out though.

 

[quikster]

this is the other RV trailer I saw with its own batteries and motors

https://www.theautopian.com/heres-e...ew-camper-thats-unlike-any-rv-youve-ever-seen