Dual fuel

[TwoJacks]

yeah, i doubt many people would make it all the way to the purchase stage without the basic understanding that it is primarily a BEV

You’d think, but it seems many plug-in hybrid owners never plug them in.

 

[TwoJacks]

Until I learn a lot more about the Harvester, and unless it is different than I suspect - I will keep my current plan.

My current bet/understanding is that the Harvester will probably be able to handle cruising highway speed. Battery will mostly be used for acceleration and regen braking. That said, if you are towing, it probably will not manage cruising highway speed and it's max range will be significantly sacrificed.

2 cases for me that would make me consider the Harvester. Towing range, and blackouts. I don't think it will give me a lot more towing range - and a diesel generator at my house could handle blackouts. Right now planning on the diesel backup generator. But then again my house will have significant solar and some batteries (hoping for house backup batteries to continue to come down on price. With my plan, perhaps the Scout can also extend my houses 100% solar use during a blackout. Sadly, most of my extended blackouts are during overcast days during winter storms.

You appear to not understand how the harvester works. The battery drives the car—period. The gas engine charges the battery—period. The battery would never be used just for acceleration because it always provides all the power to the electric motors driving the wheels. It will receive charge from regen braking all the time.

 

[DaveGunter]

You appear to not understand how the harvester works. The battery drives the car—period. The gas engine charges the battery—period. The battery would never be used just for acceleration because it always provides all the power to the electric motors driving the wheels. It will receive charge from regen braking all the time.

There is no mechanical connection between the gas engine and the drivetrain-period…but unless I’m mistaken the A/C from the gas engine generator will go directly to the A/C drive motors. Any excess will be converted to D/C and go to charge the battery. Any deficit will be supplied by the battery.

 

[TwoJacks]

There is no mechanical connection between the gas engine and the drivetrain-period…but unless I’m mistaken the A/C from the gas engine generator will go directly to the A/C drive motors. Any excess will be converted to D/C and go to charge the battery. Any deficit will be supplied by the battery.

The website just says the harvester will be used to charge the battery. Doesn’t say anything about direct power to the electric motors. Suppose that could happen, but that would require a more complicated electronic set-up. The ram only charges the battery.

 

[Chuckles]

The website just says the harvester will be used to charge the battery. Doesn’t say anything about direct power to the electric motors. Suppose that could happen, but that would require a more complicated electronic set-up. The ram only charges the battery.

I've read info about the Ramcharger saying it will send power directly to the motors from the generator in instances like full throttle or heavy towing.

 

[Mr._Bill]

To have the generator feed the wheel motors adds complexity and requires different versions of the wiring and electronics. It will just be a generator that ties into the existing charging system. There will only be one system used across all models, with programming accommodations for the various battery capacities and the add-on charger. It's cheaper and easier to update the software at the end of the line than to have to keep track of multiple versions of the controller boxes.

 

[TwoJacks]

I've read info about the Ramcharger saying it will send power directly to the motors from the generator in instances like full throttle or heavy towing.

Haven’t seen anything saying that. Would be interesting if so.

 

[DaveGunter]

I‘m no EE so i don‘t know how much more complex it would be, but it would definitely be more efficient. Pretty sure that‘s how the Volt and i3 work and from Rams website

”The generator can also increase the power to the motor and gearbox when serious power is needed.”

And with Scout saying “check back for more details later” about pretty much any tech details…I think they wrote for simplicity

 

[JungGravy]

I‘m no EE so i don‘t know how much more complex it would be, but it would definitely be more efficient. Pretty sure that‘s how the Volt and i3 work and from Rams website

”The generator can also increase the power to the motor and gearbox when serious power is needed.”

And with Scout saying “check back for more details later” about pretty much any tech details…I think they wrote for simplicity

I do remember reading when Ram said this, and thinking only Stellantis would be crazy enough to wire direct to propulsion when the battery is already doing the same job

 

[DaveGunter]

I do remember reading when Ram said this, and thinking only Stellantis would be crazy enough to wire direct to propulsion when the battery is already doing the same job

Except GM (Volt) and BMW (i3) and Nissan (ePower) have already done it this way. The inverter acts like a router for the power coming from the generator. Routing the generator power to the drive motors preferentially, depending on demand, any excess power gets routed to the battery, any deficit gets supplied by the power already stored in the battery. Less conversions from A/C to D/C or D/C to A/C, more efficient.

From Nissans website

Listen to the Nissan engineer explain it

 

[timmyhil]

I’m gonna draw up a diagram from a mechanics POV. Which is something we learn is on how to draw powertrains

 

[timmyhil]

Obviously this is not what the Scouts architecture will look like. But the concept is there on how the Harvester will work. This is from an old project that me and a bunch of friends were working on before we decided to quit from working on it.

basically how it works is the battery will be used until a percentage that will be programmed into the software Most likely. At the percentage that it’s programmed for the Harvester to kick in and begin to charge the battery. In a few shots of the OS it looks like there will be a tow mode(only time will tell what that will do).

 

[JungGravy]

that would indeed require large displacement, to meet the instantaneous kw demand of such a heavy vehicle... plus excess amperage for charging

 

[timmyhil]

that would indeed require large displacement, to meet the instantaneous kw demand of such a heavy vehicle... plus excess amperage for charging

At the moment it looks like it will be one of VWs inline 4 Turbocharged engines that produces around 230ish HP and 93kW

 

[JungGravy]

Yeah, not enough power to drive the wheels directly in my opinion. and an engine with twice the HP would add even more weight and necessitate further battery pack reduction. Which is why I still believe it makes more sense to focus the range extender on recharging, and drive propulsion using ample kw from the battery. Personally, I think I'll pass on the Scout if they go the Ramcharger route